TEAM TRACK : FOR ALL MODELRAILROADERS Index du Forum

TEAM TRACK : FOR ALL MODELRAILROADERS
LE N: 1/160, LE HO: 1/87, LE O: 1/48 ainsi que les voies étroites qui découlent de ces échelles

 FAQFAQ   RechercherRechercher   MembresMembres   GroupesGroupes   S’enregistrerS’enregistrer 
 ProfilProfil   Se connecter pour vérifier ses messages privésSe connecter pour vérifier ses messages privés   ConnexionConnexion 

3D Printing

 
Poster un nouveau sujet   Répondre au sujet    TEAM TRACK : FOR ALL MODELRAILROADERS Index du Forum -> RULES & INFOS -> TUTORIAL
Sujet précédent :: Sujet suivant  
Auteur Message
eTraxx
Member
Member

Hors ligne

Inscrit le: 04 Mar 2011
Messages: 35
Localisation: South Carolina, USA
Masculin

MessagePosté le: Sam 21 Mai - 13:03 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

First let me say that I BY NO MEANS an expert on this .. just a model railroader like you guys .. but I've managed to learn a bit and want to share it. If you see where I am wrong please let me know .. this is new to me also.

3D printing sounds like magic but if you break it down .. is pretty simple and mundane. Everyone is familar with the common Inkjet Printer. That is a 2D print. If you had an immence amount of patience you could use that Inkjet Printer to print 3D objects. Let's use a 55 gal oil drum as an example. On the left is the drum. If you break it down into sections you get something like on the right .. a bottom plate .. then a sheetmetal band .. a ring .. a band .. a ring .. a band and a ring. If you were modeling this in let's say 1:20.5 you could actually do this.



Now. suppose instead you decided to print on 100# cardstock .. around .05mm. You take one of the bands and you split it into .05mm layers. You then print each of the .05mm layers. You would have something like this ..



If you then cut all the little prints out .. and glued them together .. you would have recreated the 3D barrel using a 2D printer. Of course .. after that you would probably be in an Insane Asylum .. haha

So .. that's what the 3D printing is. Software digitally slices you model into discrete slices. The 3D printer then prints each layer. There are different printers but my understanding of the one that produces the 3D prints I ordered works like this. The printer head sprays a Acrylic Polymer .. that is one slice. A UV .. Ultra Violet light then shines on the Polymer and it hardens. The print head then moves up vertically .. and prints a second layer . then a third .. and so on until the model is printed totally in 3D. The thickness of each layer is dependent on the machine I believe but the material may also have some play in this. Shrug. I don't really know

Next, let's discuss the software needed ...
_________________
Edward Traxler
Revenir en haut
Visiter le site web du posteur
Publicité






MessagePosté le: Sam 21 Mai - 13:03 (2011)    Sujet du message: Publicité

PublicitéSupprimer les publicités ?
Revenir en haut
eTraxx
Member
Member

Hors ligne

Inscrit le: 04 Mar 2011
Messages: 35
Localisation: South Carolina, USA
Masculin

MessagePosté le: Sam 21 Mai - 13:40 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

I use Sketchup to model the objects I want to be printed in 3D. I use the free version. I KNOW there are professional programs out there that are better .. Cobalt, Solid Edge, TurboCAD .. I have never used these so I can't comment on them. If you have access to a professional 3D CAD program then great! Whatever software you use you have to be able to export a file that your 3D printing service can use.

The defacto standard is the *.stl file ... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STL_(file_format) ..

Here's a link to a "Tips and Tools" on converting a CAD file to a STL file in 3D Studio Max, ADT, AutoCAD, Revit, Rhino and Revit Platform 2009.
http://www.redeyearc.com/STLinfo.aspx

Since I have NONE of these (ha) I will continue with what I DO know a little about and that is Sketchup. I have found several ways to work the process

(1) Step one. With your model finished in Sketchup you have to export as a STL file. The problem with Sketchup is that the free version can only export 3D to .dae and Google Earth's .kmz file formats. The Pro version extends exporting support to include the .3ds, .dwg, .dxf, .fbx, .obj, .xsi, and .wrl file formats.

Note that even the Pro version of Sketchup doesn't export to .stl .. but we can fix that. There IS a STL export plugin for Sketchup you can download install for free but it's as easy to use the next program.

(2) Step two. Convert from *whatever* 3D file format to STL ..

Download MeshLab. This is a FREE (I love free) program that does a lot of things with STL files. One of these is that it can load the Sketchup .dae file and outpout .stl .. horray.
http://meshlab.sourceforge.net/

(3) Step three. Check for Water Tightness. It is just what it sounds like. The digital model needs to not have any holes in it .. where the mesh is open. A program called AccuTrans 3D will do this. The download is free and the will work for 30 days. You have to purchase it after 30 days but it is only $20 so is a great deal.
http://www.micromouse.ca/downloads.html

(4) Step four. Repair the mesh as needed. The mesh to be printed has to be cleaned up .. things like those open holes .. or multiple polygons using the same edge . .things like that. A program called netfabb will do this. They had a free version called Studio Basic that will 'heal' your mesh ..
http://www.netfabb.com/basic.php

.. there is another way .. much easier

CADspan is a 3D printing service that has a plugin for Sketchup. You basically set a couple of sliders that say how large holes will be filled .. and what detail the model should be .. and upload to CADspan. They process the file and then provide a link for downloading. The catch? Files with a lot of triangles requires CADspan PRO. When you download the plugin you get a 30 free trial of CADspan PRO. After the 30 day trial it reverts to a basic version that has a limit on the number of triangles in a model it will process.

I just went over what/how I do mine in Sketchup. Shapeways (the 3D printing service I used) has an excellent tutorial page to get you started - http://www.shapeways.com/tutorials/ .. they cover creating models for upload in Cinema 4d, 3D Studio Max, Sketchup, Blender, Maya, viaCAD, LightWave 3D ..

For example the tutorial on Sketchup covers much of what I did - http://www.shapeways.com/tutorials/sketchup_3d_printing_export_to_stl_tutor…

Next I will give a brief overview of the process of uploading and having parts printed at Shapeways. Other 3D printing services will be similar. The nice thing about Shapeways .. posssibly .. is that their printers are in the Netherlands. You guys in France MIGHT be able to drive over to the factory and pick up you prints! Smile
_________________
Edward Traxler
Revenir en haut
Visiter le site web du posteur
eTraxx
Member
Member

Hors ligne

Inscrit le: 04 Mar 2011
Messages: 35
Localisation: South Carolina, USA
Masculin

MessagePosté le: Sam 21 Mai - 14:06 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

Once you have your STL file the rest is pretty simple.

I have used another service in the past .. PrintaPart .. but the moved over to their parent company FineLine Prototyping. This is one of the premier 3D printing services capable of some crazy fine work .. but you pay for it. I'm cheap .. therefore Shapeways.

FineLine Prototyping - http://www.finelineprototyping.com/
Shapeways - http://www.shapeways.com/

Like anything else on the net .. you join Shapeways .. choose a username and password. Once that is done uploading afile is as simple as clicking a "upload" button. That's it. You browse to the file on your harddrive .. click a couple of checkboxes that say "This design is my own work" .. fill out some forms .. category, tags, title .. etc.

They will check the model to see if it can be printed. If it can, an email will tell you so.

Take time to browse around the Shapeways website ..

Tutorials - http://www.shapeways.com/tutorials/
Blog - http://www.shapeways.com/blog/ .. they tell you what's happening
Forum - http://www.shapeways.com/forum/ .. like any forum .. lots of good info here
FAQs - http://www.shapeways.com/support/faq
Materials - http://www.shapeways.com/materials/ .. this is a very import page. This tells you all the materials that can be printed. Pay close attention to the Minimum wall thickness and detail thickness. Depending on which material you want your model to be printed in you will have to modify your model to meet these minimums. Look at the Frosted Ulta Detal page .. http://www.shapeways.com/materials/frosted_detail .. which is currently their material with the best resolution .. 0.3mm Minimum wall thickness and 0.1mm minimum detail thickness. The Materails Comparsion Sheet gives a great look at the different materials - http://www.shapeways.com/materials/material-options

If you have any questions please ask. I will try to answer. Like I said .. I am new at this and the best way for us to advance our knowledge in this process is for everyone to subitt what they learn.

Here are a couple of the printings I got in yesterday. This is for my coke oven bank .. the idea is that I will make a RTV mold and cast the pieces (I need 16) in Hydrocal.

Left Column. There is also a right ..


Large Arch


Small Arch


Iron frame


Loosely assembled. I will clean them up .. do some light sanding on the banding (I am guessing that's probably about .002" deep at most) and assemble using superglue to make a master for a RTV mold.


Here's a O scale (1:50 I think) figure for a size comparison

_________________
Edward Traxler
Revenir en haut
Visiter le site web du posteur
Christophe LC.
Administrateur
Administrateur

Hors ligne

Inscrit le: 26 Jan 2009
Messages: 7 040
Localisation: On the other side
Masculin

MessagePosté le: Sam 21 Mai - 17:34 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

Thank you so much for this excellent tuto and to spend tour time to share that
Ok guys let's do it now Exclamation
For me I need to find something under MAC Okay
_________________

If you only do what you always do, you only get where you always get.
Henry Ford
Revenir en haut
jean soukiassian
Member
Member

Hors ligne

Inscrit le: 29 Jan 2009
Messages: 2 703
Localisation: les Sables d'Olonne
Masculin

MessagePosté le: Dim 22 Mai - 12:47 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

Thanks a lot for sharing, Okay Okay I will have a try, but it seems a little bit complicated for me............... Embarassed
_________________
rien ne saurait etonner un americain
j vernes
Revenir en haut
eTraxx
Member
Member

Hors ligne

Inscrit le: 04 Mar 2011
Messages: 35
Localisation: South Carolina, USA
Masculin

MessagePosté le: Dim 22 Mai - 13:07 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

Jean, it can be .. but it can be worth it. A while back I made these 6" gate valves by hand ..


They came out ok when painted


You can imagine .. was very difficult to make them look good. A while back I uploaded the Sketchup file that I had drawn up to make these by hand .. and had some printed at Shapeways. MUCH easier as you can imagine! Smile


Note that I did not have the bolt heads printed. Yesterday I added the bolts made a few small changes and uploaded the new file to Shapeways.


I am going to try and print a small spru with a valve, two valve stems and two different hand wheels. That is after another coffee or two! Smile
_________________
Edward Traxler
Revenir en haut
Visiter le site web du posteur
trainternet
Invité

Hors ligne




MessagePosté le: Dim 22 Mai - 18:21 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

Ca semble very very very interesting et très prometteur. Quelqu'un en France a-t-il déjà testé ça ?
It looks very very very interseting and promising. Did someone in France tried this method ?
Revenir en haut
Christophe LC.
Administrateur
Administrateur

Hors ligne

Inscrit le: 26 Jan 2009
Messages: 7 040
Localisation: On the other side
Masculin

MessagePosté le: Dim 22 Mai - 19:48 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

Oui je connais quelqu'un qui à une machine et c'est fabuleux, le problème étant plus la maitrise du logiciel pour faire des pièces plus complexe Okay
_________________

If you only do what you always do, you only get where you always get.
Henry Ford
Revenir en haut
jean soukiassian
Member
Member

Hors ligne

Inscrit le: 29 Jan 2009
Messages: 2 703
Localisation: les Sables d'Olonne
Masculin

MessagePosté le: Dim 22 Mai - 21:31 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

Okay, I will give a try, and let you know, Okay
_________________
rien ne saurait etonner un americain
j vernes
Revenir en haut
eTraxx
Member
Member

Hors ligne

Inscrit le: 04 Mar 2011
Messages: 35
Localisation: South Carolina, USA
Masculin

MessagePosté le: Mar 24 Mai - 14:14 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

Eipiphany ---
Yesterday I just had an intersting experience .. a lucky accident followed instanously by an epiphany.

I have been happily modeling various and sundry objects in Sketchup and then either using CADspan (if the number of triangles were not too many) or Meshlabs to convert from .dae files to .stl ... then AccuTrans to check for watertighness ..  and I have successfully uploaded files to Print-A-Part and Shapeways. I have been mostly satsified ..

... except ...

Sketchup falls down when you get to small stuff. For example .. if you try to draw a circle that is under 0.018" radius .. it won't. A error screen pops up telling you that "Radius is too small".

This was a major problem when working in O scale / 1:48 .. after all .. that means that the smallest circle/hole you can draw in Sketchup is 0.018" radius .. a 0.036" hole. That's 1.728" .. pretty darn big to not be able to draw it. Crap.

The 'Workaround' has been to draw it larger like full-size and then scale afterwards. The problem is .. that you get all kinds of erratic behaviour once those dimensions drop to around that magic ~ .018" .. Sketchup leaves holes in the model .. basically just craps out.
---
Obtuse ---
I want to apoligize for being that .. obtuse that is. I suppose I could blame it on sucking up Agent Orange in Vietnam .. or the DU/Depleted Uranium in the armor of my tank in Desert Storm .. or even the Kuwati Krud everyone had in the last little go-around in OIF.

Ever since Chuck Doan and Marc Reusser started to 'play' with 3d printing I was interested. I've had loads of fun and some success .. the major hang-up being that dang scale problem with Sketchup.
---
Revelation ---
So. I was uploading a file to Shapeways using their form .. and forgot to check the radio button for size. They ask you to check .. ( ) Meters ( ) Inches ( ) Milimeters. When I went to upload the file I got one of those messages you see .. the "You fogot to .. whatever"
.....
Please note: The STL file format has no native unit. A bit of a drawback for a 3D file format to say the least. The unit of measurement that you were using when making the model gets lost when the file is saved as an STL. So, a model that is 1 by 1 by 1, might be 1 cubic centimetre, 1 cubic inch or 1 cubic metre. This is why you have to choose the appropriate unit here so we know what size you would like your model to be.
.....

Woah. DOUBLE WOAH. I read over that a few times and let it sink in. WOAH again. A .stl file is just units. NOT a specific measurement ...

I brought up my 6" gate valve as modeled full size in Sketchup. I punched a series of holes in the flange - 'drilling' thm to clear a 3/4" bolt. Divide that by 48 to scale to O and you have a hole that is only 0.016" dia. That 0.008" radius is well below the 0.018" minimum radius that Sketchup will draw. Tossed in the bolt heads .. and added embossing on the side (curious to see if that prints).

Ok .. now this is where it got interesting ..

- The valve is a 6" valve. The throat (opening?) of the valve body is 6". In 1:48 that is .125" .. or 3.175mm
- I scaled my gate valve using the 'throat' (or whatever it is called) .. scaling the 6" to 3.175". Used CADspan and created a .stl file.
- Uploaded the file to Shapeways .. and told it that it was in * Milimeters *

SUCCESS!!!



So. There you go. I just wanted to post this up for anyone who also suffer from not understanding some basic .stl stuff with apoligies to those who TRIED to explain to someone that's evidently too dense. :/
_________________
Edward Traxler
Revenir en haut
Visiter le site web du posteur
trainternet
Invité

Hors ligne




MessagePosté le: Mar 24 Mai - 22:53 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

Hmmm... Ca ne semble pas si facile que ça à appréhender (je parle du software) !
Revenir en haut
eTraxx
Member
Member

Hors ligne

Inscrit le: 04 Mar 2011
Messages: 35
Localisation: South Carolina, USA
Masculin

MessagePosté le: Mar 24 Mai - 23:16 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

trainternet a écrit:
Hmmm... Ca ne semble pas si facile que ça à appréhender (je parle du software) !


http://sketchup.google.com/intl/fr/
_________________
Edward Traxler
Revenir en haut
Visiter le site web du posteur
eTraxx
Member
Member

Hors ligne

Inscrit le: 04 Mar 2011
Messages: 35
Localisation: South Carolina, USA
Masculin

MessagePosté le: Jeu 26 Mai - 04:09 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

Bored .. I played around with the gate valve. I completely reworked the flange to make it meet ANSI standards .. put in a little separation between where the bits bolt together.

While ago I amused myself by rending them in brass

The pic on the left (No.3) is the 'cosmetic' gate valve. This one has a close to correct ID. I modified the thing so I could use Evergreen tubing which means I had to 'bend the rules' just a bit. A 'normal' 6" pipe (or valve) .. that's the inside measurement. Standard pipe (SCH 40) for a 6" pipe is about 6-5/8" OD. Oh well .. Evergreen has 1/8" tubing which equates to 6" OD in O scale. I can live with that.

The one on the right (No.4) is 'operational' .. no .. it doesn't actually work .. ha. I mean that it has the bolts on the inner flange .. and that little projection will fit another flange .. or the ID of that 1/8" Evergreen. Figure I might go ahead and create elbows etc. There's nothing I've found that I like .. some white metal castings. The Plastruct stuff I used in the pump house is very simple .. more of a generic shape of pipe I suppose. I'm thinking if I can supply all the 'plumbing' in this size piping I could fill a void in the hobby.


_________________
Edward Traxler
Revenir en haut
Visiter le site web du posteur
Christophe LC.
Administrateur
Administrateur

Hors ligne

Inscrit le: 26 Jan 2009
Messages: 7 040
Localisation: On the other side
Masculin

MessagePosté le: Jeu 26 Mai - 04:49 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

Simply, an awesome work you did
I need to try this kind of technology, I have a "couple" of machine to draw Laughing
I'm surprised that you draw it and they are able to print it, in "one block" I mean not in differents elements (top, flange, etc...)
_________________

If you only do what you always do, you only get where you always get.
Henry Ford
Revenir en haut
eTraxx
Member
Member

Hors ligne

Inscrit le: 04 Mar 2011
Messages: 35
Localisation: South Carolina, USA
Masculin

MessagePosté le: Jeu 26 Mai - 04:56 (2011)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing Répondre en citant

Christophe. It's interesting how they do it. After you upload the file they take it and 'slice' it into layers like a cake .. made of layers only a few thousands thick. To the printer .. it only needs to print each layer .. doesn't matter .. flanges or whatever .. come to think of it .. it is like a CT scan ..

Ha. Thanks for the complement. When I get these printed it will be acrylic and not brass (darn) .. but will be fun to see how much detail they can actually print.
_________________
Edward Traxler
Revenir en haut
Visiter le site web du posteur
Contenu Sponsorisé






MessagePosté le: Aujourd’hui à 23:22 (2017)    Sujet du message: 3D Printing

Revenir en haut
Montrer les messages depuis:   
Poster un nouveau sujet   Répondre au sujet    TEAM TRACK : FOR ALL MODELRAILROADERS Index du Forum -> RULES & INFOS -> TUTORIAL Toutes les heures sont au format GMT + 1 Heure
Page 1 sur 1

 
Sauter vers:  

Index | Creer un forum | Forum gratuit d’entraide | Annuaire des forums gratuits | Signaler une violation | Conditions générales d'utilisation
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
Traduction par : phpBB-fr.com